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> and it's missing a lot without it

Could you clarify what it is missing exactly? Genuinely curious as I read the books before watching the movie and I didn't really feel like the movie was missing anything?

> The book is meant to be about _our future_ and the fact that Muslims still exist and are important in the future isn't just like "flavor", it was an innovative idea at the time in science fiction and still is.

Respectfully I think this is reading too deep into it. Herbert borrowed Arabic words and concepts to build a hardy middle-eastern-adjacent culture, it's hardly the focus of the book.



> Respectfully I think this is reading too deep into it. Herbert borrowed Arabic words and concepts to build a hardy middle-eastern-adjacent culture, it's hardly the focus of the book.

https://reactormag.com/the-muslimness-of-dune-a-close-readin...

It's more than that.


I always thought the Arabic references in Dune, and also the desert planet that produces the fuel by which commerce operates, was a downright obvious social commentary on oil and the geopolitics at the time the book was published

Honestly I always thought the metaphor was borderline heavy handed, to the point that I never continued reading after the first book because the metaphor was boring to me

Now I feel positively gaslit. Did I imagine all this?


I’m not sure the timing actually works out for that. Arab oil production was significantly behind the United States and Russia during the Second World War, but represented a major share of oil production by 1973, as seen in the effects of the embargo imposed in response to the Yom Kippur War.

Dune was written in the 1950’s, but the geopolitical metaphors are a few decades older than that; the character of Paul Atreides is clearly a parallel to T.E. Lawrence, which places the geopolitical context firmly within the First World War. That’s a different part of the Middle East (the Levant as opposed to the Hejaz and Gulf), a different strategic value relating to long distance travel (the Suez Canal as opposed to oil), and a much older world of competing colonizers. And not to put too fine a point on it, the Ottomans also had a padishah emperor!


No, the reference to Arabic oil is heavy-handed at least, but Frank Herbert has denied this was intentionally just that, without denying there were obvious elements. He’s claimed they represent a wider yearning for freedom.


opec was formed in 01960; dune was published as a serial in 01963 and as a book in 01965, in the usa, by an author from the usa

https://www.eia.gov/energyexplained/oil-and-petroleum-produc... says that in 01960 the usa produced 8.11 million barrels of oil per day and consumed 9.80, with net imports of 1.61. (not sure what happened to the other 0.08.) net imports had grown dramatically over the previous decade, and oil was already a significant factor in usa political involvement in the middle east, in affairs such as the iranian coup. also, petroleum was a major strategic resource in the second world war; the usa's naval blockade against japanese oil imports is commonly cited as a major factor in japan's decision to attack the usa

by 01965 us net imports were up to 2.28 million barrels per day, so it was an issue of growing geopolitical importance, but still only a fraction of the importance opec and oil imports would have in the 01970s


You didn't imagine it, but he didn't draw all his references from the arabian peninsula and islamic culture is more than saudi arabia.


Many of the Arabic words used in the books have a distinctively Francophone flair to them (e.g. "bene" rather than "bani"). Now consider that at the time Herbert worked on this books, Algerian War of Independence was an ongoing anti-colonialist war waged by people who were culturally and linguistically mostly Arabic with a significant Berber element...


Very interesting read, thank you.


The Fremen follow the Zensunni religion (exactly what it sounds like), so continuity with real world cultures is a big part of the story. Another example, the Bene Gesserit are called Reverend Mother.


And presumably ‘Gesserit’ is meant to be a distortion of ‘Jesuit’


What? No, it's a Latin word, and not a distortion of anything. It's a conjugation of the verb 'gero', which has several meanings - but when put next to 'bene', most likely means 'to behave, conduct oneself, comport oneself'. You can see the conjugation table here: https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/gero#Latin. And it forms part of the legal Latin phrase 'Quamdiu se bene gesserit', or 'So long as he shall behave himself properly'. (https://www.oxfordreference.com/display/10.1093/acref/978019...).


We don't know what Herbert actually meant by "Bene Gesserit", or even whether it has strictly one meaning, since he never elaborated on that. Given how syncretic everything else is, it is entirely plausible that there are multiple references encoded in the name. The Latin one is fairly obvious given that they refer to each other as "Reverend Mothers".

But then note that Bene Tleilaxu is clearly not Latin, and makes more sense if you interpret the word "bene" ("bani") in its Arabic meaning - "descendants of", in practice often referring to tribes and similar groupings (as in Bani Quraish or Bani Isra'il) - Tleilax being their home planet. If we apply the same to "Bene Gesserit", it would mean "Daughters of ???". One possibility then would be Arabic "Jazirah", "peninsula".

An even more interesting theory along these lines is that "Gesserit" refers to the mythical demon-slaying hero-king Gesser (aka Geser aka Gesar) of the Mongolian and Tibetan folklore. In Mongolian, "... of Gesar" is "Geseriyn". Gesar is the Chosen Son of the Sky God (head of the pantheon), the first man who descended from Heaven to purge the world of evil demons that menace humanity - it sure does make for some interesting parallels with Kwizats Haderach...

Again, to re-iterate, it's entirely possible that all of these are simultaneously true. Herbert liked referencing obscure (to his culture) folklore, so a play on words like this could well be intentional.




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