I should have said the "Jane Fonda of today"... everyone does dumb things and I didn't agree with everything she did when young. Recent interviews have shown a lot of maturity.
I'll go down that road with you. I agree with Jane on a great many issues, I'm sure. I certainly don't dislike her for her overall political leanings. And yet, I can't look at her without thinking about what she did in Vietnam.
The idea that she passed POW secrets to their captors has been debunked to my satisfaction. But the other stuff she did, calling our POWs liars and touring to support the army we were fighting, is beyond the pale.
Like, you can say we shouldn't be attacking Iran and I won't argue against you. But if you actually went to Iran in support of their soldiers and armies over ours, except maybe as a journalist who documents bad stuff you discover us doing, then I'm going to invite you to stay there.
That's a bit of a weird position to take. You seem to put "American forces" in a special bucket where, even if the actions the US military are taking is wrong, the support and reputation of "American forces" should still be protected at all costs, and the people they're doing wrong things to don't get to have any support.
Let's imagine an alternate universe where Russia didn't invade Ukraine. There were rumors that they were considering it, though, and Europe was not feeling particularly secure, afraid that Russia would not stop with Ukraine. This Ukraine is, like in our universe, nominally an ally of the West, though not the closest of terms. Poland, a US ally and NATO member, afraid that Russia would invade Ukraine and use it as a forward base to attack Poland, decides to preemptively invade Ukraine in order to establish its own forward base, a buffer zone.
I think many people in the US, myself (half Polish from my mom's side) included, would think this was a horrible thing for Poland to do. A bunch of us decide we're going to support Ukraine, protest on their behalf, and donate to their cause. Would you object to that? If not, then that's hypocritical. If so, that's... not a great look for you either.
> You seem to put "American forces" in a special bucket where,
I'm a vet. My default setting is to support American troops unless they're shown to be acting wrongly.
> even if the actions the US military are taking is wrong,
That's a bizarre little strawman. No. I can support the soldiers, sailors, and airmen while believing their leadership is wrong. By civilian analogy, I support the employees of HHS even if I think their boss is an idiot.
> the support and reputation of "American forces" should still be protected at all costs, and the people they're doing wrong things to don't get to have any support.
Your words, not mine. I don't feel that way. American leadership orders all kinds of jackassery. The people doing their jobs, presuming they're not committing war crimes (sorry if that was going to be your next gotcha), have my support. I've not heard any accusations that the POWs Fonda "visited", as though Hanoi Hilton was a zoo and they were wildlife on display, were legitimately war criminals. If they were, I would not support them. I for damn sure would not have supported the North Vietnamese government against our own solders, though. If our guys were in the wrong, it would be perfectly possible to prosecute both sets of people.
> Let's imagine an alternate universe
Let me stop you right there. We don't have to invent increasingly contrived scenarios to debate the core case: is it OK to provide aid and comfort to the enemy? It's not. It doesn't mean you have to automatically say your own military is flawless, either. But in the common case, I'm vastly more likely to support the general actions of the US military over those of the People's Army of Vietnam. I don't think that's an especially hot take.
Replying to myself: indifferent in the context of Americans committing what I consider to be traitorous acts against Americans. If you go join the IDF and shoot your way through Gaza, I'm going to think you're a POS. But I think you'll be a different kind of POS than Fonda was in Vietnam, which is the discussion at hand here.
Healthcare professionals: "Gathering in large groups in causing a genocide of the old, infirm, and immunocompromised!"
Healthcare professionals a week later: "Racism is a global health crisis and you must gather and protest in large groups to combat it. No, these specific gatherings won't spread COVID."
Except that's not what they said. Large gatherings anywhere were risky with people in close proximity. Outdoor events with many people in close proximity could become super spreader events. Unless the outdoor event was a politically aligned protest. In that case the rules didn't apply and there was no risk of it becoming a super spreader event.
Big outdoor gatherings *for right-wing causes*: big risk.
Big outdoor gatherings *for left-wing causes*: low risk.
I do not recall any such claims about right wing things.
I do recall worry about right wing things which were "outdoor"--but would have a lot of indoor spillover. Things like that motorcycle thing--the motorcycle part was outdoors but you would have a lot of people going to bars and the like in the evening. The right always tried to portray it as political, but only by oversimplification.
Marcan was clearly mentally unwell. He delusionally thought there was some harassment mob after him. After the fallout with Linux kernel devs, the lolipedo accusations, and him being outed as the vtuber Asahi Lina, he arguably did the correct thing: deleted every social media account and abandoned Asahi Linux. I hope he stepped away from screens and spent some time outdoors.
Homebuilding in the Southern and Western US is almost entirely based on illegal labor. Trump's immigration policies have dried that labor pool up. These poor helpless homebuilders are getting exactly what they voted for and instead of blaming themselves they want to blame the easiest target at the moment: data centers
No response, not surprised. Leftists in the US are likely further left than anywhere else in the developed world. Mutilating children in the name of LGBTQ, open borders, political violence, etc.
Made me spit out my coffee. Hanoi Jane Fonda isn't very cool, and does not have a great head on her shoulders.
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